tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9139464357237074361.post5093971615680932192..comments2023-11-13T16:30:40.096+13:00Comments on Editing the Herald: League of gentlemenJameshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12661495023149576052noreply@blogger.comBlogger14125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9139464357237074361.post-68574882418945015112009-05-21T21:23:04.838+12:002009-05-21T21:23:04.838+12:00JP_Rocks, I totally understand your point about no...JP_Rocks, I totally understand your point about not taking responsibility for things they have done and later regret, but I think in this case it's clear that whatever happened that night, it's had some fairly significant effects on the woman concerned. <br /><br />And your point "rape occurs when there is sex after the woman says no" is a widespread misconception, and just perpetuates the idea that men are always up for it, and women are the ones that must stop sex from happening. <br /><br />Firstly, both men and woman are victims of sexual violence, but secondly, legally, the onus is actually on both parties to get consent from each other - so actually what is more important than saying "no" is saying "yes". The law recognises that sometimes people aren't able to say "no" for whatever reason - you freak out, you think that something worse may happen to you if you say no etc. <br /><br />The odious commentators on Your Views and their like are part of the reason NZ has one of the highest levels of sexual violence in the developed world. Hardly something to be proud of.Alicenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9139464357237074361.post-88052105865229598922009-05-18T17:16:00.000+12:002009-05-18T17:16:00.000+12:00The TV commentator and the players "loved" the wom...The TV commentator and the players "loved" the woman in Christchurch. Tony Veitch "hated" his partner. Both employment outcomes are identical. An injustice in the former case, in my book.Hans Versluyshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15331809478789352312noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9139464357237074361.post-22345878112945757202009-05-17T13:28:00.000+12:002009-05-17T13:28:00.000+12:00He doesn't deserve to lose his job for engaging in...He doesn't deserve to lose his job for engaging in consensual group sex - you're right, Uroskin, there's nothing wrong with that.<br /><br />But he does deserve to lose it for irrevocably damaging his own and his employer's public reputation by abusing his public status to participate in the gross exploitation of a(at the time) naive and vulnerable young woman, while he was representing his employers on an official trip.<br /><br />At least that's how I see it.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9139464357237074361.post-42918333132979347212009-05-17T12:51:00.000+12:002009-05-17T12:51:00.000+12:00Nothing wrong with consensual sex, nothing wrong w...Nothing wrong with consensual sex, nothing wrong with consensual group sex, nothing to see here, move on.<br />But Mr Johns doesn't deserve to lose his day time job because of his hobby.Hans Versluyshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15331809478789352312noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9139464357237074361.post-21601250630995581712009-05-16T10:40:00.000+12:002009-05-16T10:40:00.000+12:00Dear Mr Authority... I'm a little perplexed by the...Dear Mr Authority... I'm a little perplexed by the link to murder you mention in the last paragraph.<br /><br />Also,<br />"the time for a genuine complaint to <B>laid</B>." what an odd sense of humour I've been <B> endowed</B> with.Pete Mhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03292338984328864756noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9139464357237074361.post-33264383177524359792009-05-16T08:22:00.000+12:002009-05-16T08:22:00.000+12:00I just wanted to say - nice headline on this post....I just wanted to say - nice headline on this post. Top marks.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9139464357237074361.post-55469130560937563082009-05-16T00:01:00.000+12:002009-05-16T00:01:00.000+12:00One girl and 12 guys? I think all those guys are ...One girl and 12 guys? I think all those guys are mostly gay. Its not a binary thing either.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9139464357237074361.post-82425622351177273692009-05-15T22:57:00.000+12:002009-05-15T22:57:00.000+12:00Perhaps this was slightly too controversial a topi...Perhaps this was slightly too controversial a topic to try and make this point, because it looks like I failed miserably. I was trying to rant about personal responsibility for our choices and actions, of which there is not nearly enough of in todays society. Everything is always someone else's fault. Apologies for any offence caused.<br /><br />For the record, I feel sympathy for all parties involved. Johns and his wife, Claire and her future partners, and anyone else involved or suspected of being involved by their partners. There are no winners here.JP_Rocksnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9139464357237074361.post-65610366460032297642009-05-15T20:17:00.000+12:002009-05-15T20:17:00.000+12:00James I can't tell you how glad I am to hear someo...James I can't tell you how glad I am to hear someone say what you've just said. I agree completely.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9139464357237074361.post-39057124264070370662009-05-15T18:07:00.000+12:002009-05-15T18:07:00.000+12:00Yeah, assuming 'implicit consent' is one thing whe...Yeah, assuming 'implicit consent' is one thing when it's your partner in a loving relationship. <br /><br />When it's one drunk teenager in a roomful of large, horny rugby players, it's rather another.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9139464357237074361.post-21418779007492982872009-05-15T15:21:00.000+12:002009-05-15T15:21:00.000+12:00Long time reader, first time commenter...
I agree...Long time reader, first time commenter...<br /><br />I agree with you, James. Consent is not black and white. <br />In particular, considering the balance of power in that room that night - a 19 year old girl and 12 burly men - how much power did she have to consent (or not?) <br />Sure, maybe she didn't actually say no, but that doesn't equate to giving full and free consent. <br />What happened may not be grounds for a court case, but it was certainly totally unfair and immoral for those men to take advantage of her.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9139464357237074361.post-74643511393409619752009-05-15T14:53:00.000+12:002009-05-15T14:53:00.000+12:00I don't know, JP_Rocks. I'm not sure that I believ...I don't know, JP_Rocks. I'm not sure that I believe that this is an issue of balance. I also don't think that sexual consent is a binary thing.<br /><br />And I'm not sure I feel particularly sorry for Matthew Johns or any of the other mystery men involved.Jameshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12661495023149576052noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9139464357237074361.post-84567770481030939352009-05-15T14:16:00.000+12:002009-05-15T14:16:00.000+12:00The whole thing is just so wrong, I don't even kno...The whole thing is just so wrong, I don't even know where to start.<br /><br />I wish they wouldn't make your views topics for loaded stories like this.EDITITORIAL CRACKPIPEnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9139464357237074361.post-89557309839137540672009-05-15T14:06:00.000+12:002009-05-15T14:06:00.000+12:00Yes, but Jimmy, how do you know she didn't love it...Yes, but Jimmy, how do you know she didn't love it? I find this sort of article moderately refreshing as it's taking an alternative view on a topic. Prior to this, it had only been Matty Johns professing his innocence, which was backed up by the NZ Police deciding not to press any charges at the time. <br /><br />Drunk chicks do stupid things. Things they wouldn't do when they were sober. Drunk guys, ditto. And you know what, some people, both male and female, enjoy gang bangs. No my cup of darjeeling, and probably not yours, but some people like that flavour.<br /><br />If "Law and Order: SVU" is to be believed, rape occurs when there is sex after the woman says no. Rape doesnt occur when a woman wakes up the next day regretting what she did the night before, or regretting what she implicitly consented to have done to her. Now I'm not saying that she has no right to regret it, or to be traumatised by it. For example, I chose to pay $12 to see "The Wedding Planner", which still haunts me to this day. But I dont blame JLo and McConnahy for my choice to see that bucket of crap, nor do I blame the chick I went with for picking the movie. I consented to seeing the movie, and I have to accept responsibility for that and the consequences that it entails. <br /><br />All parties involved are victims here. As a direct result of the incident, "Claire" lost years from her life to depression, and Matty Johns has lost an untold level of trust from his wife, kids, and the public at large. However, it is "Claire"'s utter refusal to accept responsibility and consequences, and the media outlet that sought her out, that have caused this recent explosion of opinion on the matter. And it's nice to hear alternative sides of a story for a change.JP_Rocksnoreply@blogger.com